Author: rusty0t

What Is The Deal With 2009?

If you have done some digging online about what exactly to look for when searching rolls, you have almost certainly seen mention of keeping any 2009 minted coinage regardless of denomination. This suggestion is often given with a mere mention of “2009 was a low mintage year,” and little else.

So what does that mean?
Let’s run some numbers.

Put simply, several financial reasons. The country was still just starting to lick it’s wounds from the weak economic infrastructure caused by the real estate crash of 2006-2007 as well as the following recession of 2007-2009. Essentially 4 years of market stagnation and decline. All of this meant less money flowing in and out of the pockets of citizens and businesses alike. To put it simply: broke people don’t spend money. The combination of events ultimately culminated in the United States Mint greatly slowing production of coinage in the year 2009. If we take a look at the mintage totals  from the year 2009, we see a stark contrast to the previous years, most notably the numbers of previous year. In 2008 the Mint coined over $1.3 Billion dollars worth of assorted denominations. In 2009 the Mint coined only $601 Million dollars in coins. That is just under half as much as the year before, and the lowest total dollar amount minted since 1992. That is significant for many more reasons than what I could hope to cover in a mere article and could probably fill an entire book with it’s implications on the economy. With that being said, let’s just focus on a few of the good and bad aspects that having these total mintage numbers available to us today means for numismatics of tomorrow.

The Bad – The Market Is Saturated Before It Ever Opens

Few times in US history have the citizens of our country been made so acutely aware of a coin shortage as it transpires. This inspired many collectors, and even some people just looking to profit in the future, to hoard any and all 2009 minted coins they could come across. Here is a bit of anecdotal evidence of this: I have personally seen the collection of a friend who has about $200 face value in 2009 uncirculated, bank wrapped rolls of cents alone. It boils down to around 100 rolls of each reverse variety per mint. That’s not even including his hoard of rolls upon rolls of each of the 6 varieties of quarters and mound of proof sets that lie within the same collection. Many of us would think it’s insane to keep such a quantity of only one year of coins on hand, yet hoarding of 2009 coins is quite commonplace and recommended by many coin roll hunters and numismatists alike. I do personally hang on to some of the 2009’s that I come across, so long as they remain in near mint state condition. Unfortunately that is an uncommon feat for ten year old circulated coinage. What does this mean for those who are keeping every single coin that they come across minted in 2009, regardless of condition? Simply put, there is going to be no future market for the coins that they are hoarding. Collectors are a particular breed, and very picky about the specimens that they are willing to pay top dollar for. If a coin collector may choose between a MS64 Graded 1884-O Morgan dollar for $70 and a scratched, discolored, crusty cull of the same year and mint for $20 out of their local coin store’s bargain bin, it’s pretty obvious the choice that they would make. The same is going to be true for crusty, discolored, damaged 2009 coins. It’s almost always a buyer’s market, and the buyers don’t want that. With the hoard of people with hundreds or thousands of brand new uncirculated 2009 coinage sitting in vaults and collectors homes, it’s seemingly pointless to pick the remaining examples out of circulation, right? Well, maybe not.

The Good – Easy(ish) Cash For Reselling 2009 Coinage.

Those non-MS coins you may find floating around in coin rolls or pocket change do have a market. What may be surprising is that the market for circulated 2009 coins is in the here and now. If you head over to eBay and search realized auctions of circulated, even lower quality examples of 2009 coins of various denomination, you will see that often times these eBay lots nearly always realize more than face value. Sometimes as much as 1.5 to 2 times as much, if not much more for better conditions and mint state examples. That may sound insignificant, but consider this. Let’s say for example that you search three or four boxes of Quarters in a month and find 40 various 2009 Quarters. That is $10 face value. Following the example of previously realized auctions, that turns $10 into $15, perhaps even $20+. Wash, rinse, repeat. You can also easily see very handsome returns on larger lots, though they often take a much longer time to sell. Just getting 1.5X face value will net you $150 from 10 rolls of quarters, around $42-$45 profit after taking shipping into consideration. If you do manage to grab hold of uncirculated, bank wrapped rolls of 2009 coins, you can expect a much more significant return if you choose to sell now.

A few examples:

One 2009P D.C. Quarter selling for $1.65 ($1.45 over face value)

One 2009D D.C. Quarter selling for $1.79 ($1.54 over face value)

One 2009D Dime selling for $1.50 ($1.40 over face value) This example in particular is selling for more than a silver dime!

Final Thoughts

If you are so inclined to do so, keep all of the 2009’s you may happen across. After all, there is no wrong way to coin roll hunt and collect.

As always, stay tuned for more. I’m currently working on having a new post at least every other day for the near future.

Precious Metal In Coins – A Brief Explanation Of Copper And Silver Coins

For the purposes of this article, I will be referring only to copper and silver coins that are still being found in circulation. The U.S. did mint gold coins for circulation until 1933, though the likelihood of finding one in circulation today is so astronomically and impossibly low that I felt it would best be omitted from this discussion.

Copper

Here is a fun fact that I’m sure many of you reading probably already knew: All Pennies minted prior to 1982 contain 95% Copper and 5% Zinc! In 1982 the mint adjusted the metal content of Pennies into a 97.5% Zinc core and 2.5% copper as an exterior plating material. This will explain why you may come across worn and weathered modern Lincoln cents with grayish metallic rims and plating. As a side note, there are both zinc and copper variants of the 1982 Penny. Weighing them is the easiest option to determine metal content as a zinc cent will weigh around 2.5 grams whereas a copper cent will weigh around 3.1 grams. As I write this in March of 2019, the inherent copper content of a 95% copper Penny is about 1.8 cents. Nearly double the face value intended of the coin. At this point in time however, it is illegal to melt copper Pennies in the United States for profit, meaning you may not legally melt them into bars and sell them. Many people see reason to hoard all copper cents that they come across in hopes of potentially selling their hoard as bullion for above face value in the future, similar to the ways that we trade silver coins today.

Silver

Speaking of silver coins, let’s get to the real meat and potatoes of precious metals. All Dimes, Quarters, and Half Dollars minted prior to 1965 (that being coins that bear the year 1964 and before) contain 90% silver. As a side note: Half Dollars minted in the years of 1965 through 1970 contain 40% silver, though they were the only denomination to possess any silver past 1964. The easiest way to identify a silver coin, aside from the year minted on the obverse, is by visually inspecting the rim of the coin. Silver coins do not feature the brownish red strip of copper visible on modern clad coinage. This visual test is particularly handy when unwrapping rolls of coins, as the silver edge will stand out easily and make any coins of interest easy to pick out and inspect further.

An interesting fact that some you may not know is that Nickels were once made out of silver too! During U.S. involvement in WWII, the mint adjusted the metal content of Nickels to contain 35% silver in an effort to conserve materials for the war effort. This took place from the year 1942 until 1945. These “War Nickels” as they are most commonly referred to, are easily identified by the oversize mint mark above the Monticello building on the reverse of the coin. If you see a jumbo P, D, or S above the building on a Nickel from those years, you’ve got silver.

Somewhat related to the topic of silver coinage, it may be of interest to know that contrary to a somewhat popular belief, modern “silver dollars” contain absolutely NO silver. Large Eisenhower dollar coins minted in 1971 through 1978 as well as Susan B. Anthony small dollar coins minted from 1979 to 1981 and then again in 1999 all contain 0% silver, save for a few special Eisenhower dollars minted for special Bicentennial silver proof sets. The term “silver dollar” was carried over from long ago and is now a misnomer with modern clad dollar coins.

Now, for those of you that may be unaware of what all of this really means, here is the proverbial lightbulb to explain why exactly silver is such a big deal.

Any 90% silver coin is worth, at the time of this being written, anywhere from 10 to 12 times face value. It is worth noting that these values often fluctuate along with the spot price of silver, a value that generally changes daily by a few cents. That means a 90% silver dime would be worth anywhere from $1.00 to $1.20 in silver content alone, not to mention potential numismatic premiums. I know what you’re thinking, and I get it. Making $1.20 off of a Dime is great and all, but it seems like a lot of effort for a buck. I concur, it is a lot of work for a meager dollar. However, when you consider accumulating even just $5 face value of silver Dimes over a period of time, that $1 suddenly spikes to well over $50. Your initial capital of $5 just multiplied 10 times over. It is exactly these extreme premiums on silver coins that drive many people to search Dimes and Half dollars. A fair bit of warning however, it is extremely uncommon to come across silver quarters in circulation for one reason or another. They were hoarded in the mid-sixties to the early-seventies and rarely make an appearance in coin rolls. I have almost entirely stopped searching Quarters myself unless I happen to find a large amount of customer wrapped rolls to examine. In my experience the most common denominations to find silver are in order as follows: Half Dollars, Dimes, Nickels, and finally Quarters.

One last thing. You will almost certainly encounter foreign coins in your many future hunts. Many countries use steel and other non precious metals in minting their coinage, meaning no copper edge to distinguish that it is a clad coin. I will probably never forget my disappointment of finding a modern Canadian dime in one of my first Dime searches, and thinking I had finally found silver after seeing the solid silver colored edge of the coin. If you’re unsure of what you have found, you can click here to go to NGC’s website to view a database of world coins that contain silver. I have found that an easy way to quickly find what you are searching for on that page is to use CTRL+F and search by country. This site has proved immensely beneficial to have bookmarked in my toolbar, something you may consider doing for this very blog.

Pickup Banks, And How To Find An Awesome One.

Pickup Banks

Now that we have learned the importance of the role of the Dump Bank in my previous post, it’s time to start looking for a bank to procure our coin rolls from.

Policy

Policy will become familiar term when it comes to anything related to banking. Some banks near me have a policy that requires an individual to possess a business account to acquire change from their locations, this being the worst case scenario. A good majority of bank branches will sell you change so long as you are an account holder with their company. It is less common to find a bank that sells rolled change to non-members but there are locations that do exactly that.

Chase Banks are a noteworthy example, and at the time that I write this, they allow transactions up to $100 to be carried out by people without an account. If you do happen to have a few Chase branches near you, it will certainly prove to be a beneficial corporation to have in your bank hopping rotation.

What Are You Looking To Pick Up?

It may perhaps be a good idea to have a gameplan before waltzing into any old bank and asking for $20 in change. Have an idea on what exactly it is that you want to accomplish by coin roll hunting. Is it solely to find silver? Are you aiming to fill up Whitman Folders with every year and mintmark of a given denomination? Are you going to cherrypick subtle mint errors like doubled dies, cud errors, and clipped planchets? There are as many reasons and goals to fulfill via roll hunting as there are people who participate in the hobby. I will have a post over the coming weeks depicting several different reasoning’s for participating in the hobby as well, so keep your eyes open and ensure that you are following the blog.

What’s In A Roll?

It is worth knowing that each denomination’s rolls will contain different amounts of coins. For example;

  • 50 Pennies = $0.50 Roll
  • 40 Nickels = $2.00 Roll
  • 50 Dimes = $5.00 Roll
  • 40 Quarters = $10.00 Roll
  • 20 Half Dollars = $10.00 Roll.

With this information in mind, we can calculate the total cost of boxes of these coins, with each box containing 50 rolls of coins.

  • 50 Rolls of Pennies = $25.00
  • 50 Rolls of Nickels = $100.00
  • 50 Rolls of Dimes = $250.00
  • 50 Rolls of Quarters = $500.00
  • 50 Rolls of Half Dollars = $500.00

That’s a lot of capital if you want to be searching Half Dollars and Dimes right? Well it can be, if you’re going for boxes of coins at a time. It can be much easier to acquire a tray of coins from a under-stocked bank as opposed to a box of coinage. A tray of coins consists of 10 or 20 rolls of coins. Many of the banks near me use 20 roll trays of Dimes and Pennies, and 10 roll trays of Nickels and Quarters. This ambiguity between bank locations can be prevented if you clearly state the dollar amount of Dimes you are looking for versus saying that you need a tray or a few rolls. If you are dead set on boxes, as I’m sure many of us are, it is worth noting that many locations will not have a box of coins available at any given point. If this is the case, you may ask if they can start ordering you boxes of your preferred coin every week. If they do allow this, take a card (generally on the tellers counter) and provide your name, phone number, and a reminder to call when the coins are delivered. If you get this set up, please make it a point to pick the coins up within a day or two of them being delivered. This keeps relationships between yourself and the branch employees strong.

A Tip To Save Time

It is my suggestion to call ahead to several bank locations in your area prior to visiting in person. This is especially important if you are planning to pick up boxes. Verify the banks policy regarding the sales of change to individuals without a bank account, determine the requirements of creating a bank account if it is needed, ask how much you can acquire at one time, and tell them what you are looking for whether it’s a few rolls of Dimes up to multiple boxes of Nickels. My biggest suggestion is maintaining an Excel Spreadsheet containing information that you have acquired about each branch that you visit. Do they have a coin machine, do they sell rolls to non-account-holders, etc. as that can quickly lead you to planning an efficient route around town when you plan to dump and pickup.

Bank Hopping

Bank Hopping is almost a hobby in itself. I often visit multiple bank locations in the same day to pick up smaller quantities of rolls. It usually goes something like this; I start by traveling to the farthest bank that I anticipate visiting. I will usually go with a rough idea of what I’m looking to pick up that day, and pick up bits and pieces at each location I visit. For example let’s say I am aiming to search $150 in Dimes, $60 in Nickels, and $20 in Pennies. I can easily acquire that at 3 banks if I pick up trays of each denomination at each location, i.e. $50 in Dimes, $20 in Nickels, and $5 or $10 in Pennies every time I stop, just depending on what is available at any given location. It may seem counter intuitive to visit multiple locations but it does provide a few benefits. If you are visiting a location for the first time, I would encourage you to start small. A tray of one denomination, if that. Gauge the reactions of the teller you are talking to and ask about picking up larger sums in the future. Many times you only need to visit a branch one time to have them start ordering boxes for you.

By visiting multiple locations frequently, you will familiarize yourself with the general attitude of any given branch that you may plan on visiting again in the future. I used this method to gauge which locations kept the most change on hand and which locations kept the bare minimum. At probably 6 of the 8 banks I have received change from, they have been more than happy to help.

A Few Important Things To Remember

Pick up banks are easier to find than dump banks in my opinion. You can always start fresh and find a new place to find coins, though it may prove to be much more difficult to locate a spot to deposit large sums of coins. This is not to say that you should abuse your pickup bank, but keep in mind that while it is very important, it’s role can be fulfilled by a different bank fairly easily.

As a bit of anecdotal evidence: There is one bank nearby that went from providing me with boxes of Pennies weekly to wanting to cut back and provide to me, at most, $5 in Pennies. It was an unfortunate situation but that particular bank literately shares a parking lot with another bank. I walked across the parking lot, opened an account with the other bank, and walked out with a box of pennies. It took all of 10 minutes and now I know to not waste my time visiting the old bank I was using.

It is worth noting that some banks have dealt with coin roll hunters before, even in small towns. I would wager that staff in a small town bank is more likely to remember a problematic coin searcher than a bigger city location. If they ask “Why do you need it?” be honest. You are searching for coins for your Whitman Folders, you and you kid look for cool stuff on the weekends, your grandpa taught you about coins and you’re fascinated by them, etc. It may be tempting to throw out a quick white lie and say that it’s for a business, but those lies snowball into you needing a business account, etc. Don’t make stuff up. It is even more important to let the bank know that you will NOT be bringing the coins back to their location. As we learned previously, that is the golden rule of coin roll hunting and the fastest way to get sent to the curb by the bank.

Dump Banks. The Backbone Of Coin Roll Hunting, And Tips To Find An Awesome One.

Dump banks.

Such a seemingly callous term for some of the bank branches that I treasure the most. For the uninitiated, first of all welcome. There are snacks and punch in the corner. In all seriousness though, the “dump bank” is exactly what it sounds like. The bank branch that we “dump” all of our undesired coins back to after sorting through them. It is important to choose a dump spot carefully, and I would say that in my personal experience it would be the first step on your journey before ever picking up that first box of coins.

But First, A Rant!

Before we go any further into this lesson, please repeat the mantra with me.

“I am a good coin roll hunter. I will not dump coins at the same bank I picked them up at.”

The absolute fastest way to get a soft ban from a bank is attempting to return coins to the same location that you procured them from initially. The amount of online forum posts that I have seen that feature angry patrons cursing about their bank refusing to take back $250 in dimes mere days after they picked them up from the same bank is mind boggling. I have even seen Facebook posts that mention patrons returning rolled coins to exchange for new rolls if you can believe that. I really do struggle to not use colorful vocabulary to describe these people, but I fully intend to maintain an all ages approach to this blog. Listen friends and readers, bottom line is that while many people will preach that “it’s the bank’s job to swap money for money,” please know that it is indeed NOT inherently the bank’s job to please you or do favors for you, take up vault space for you, add logistical costs of shipping and receiving coins on a frequent basis, or generally deal with a rude jerk of a customer. When you make a habit of buying rolled coins or depositing large amounts of coins at a bank, you will be remembered. It took less than a week for tellers to know my name and what I was there for at each of the banks that I visit, and that’s with me using about 8 bank locations for picking up and 2 for dumping. If I walk into any of those branches now, they know I’m the coin guy. Please know that if you make a ruckus about them not doing you a favor or throw a temper tantrum that they will remember you for an entirely different reason. None of us want that or need the negative press on the hobby.

ANYWAY! Apologies for the mini rant. There are a few predominant policies that you may encounter at a bank that you may intend to use for dumping. The three most common methods of depositing coins are as follows:

Coin Counting Machines

To me, this is the most desirable option. It’s worth noting that I have personally encountered two types of coin machine. The self service, and the employee operated. First you may encounter a branch that has a machine in the back and a teller will take the coins in a bag or box and deposit them for you. Second, and my personal favorite, is the lobby based coin counting machine. These machines are in the open and you yourself deposit coins into the machine. I prefer these as they don’t require a teller to leave his or her post to deal with your coins and prevents a line from forming, especially during a midday rush which is common in my area. From this point you may generally choose between cash in hand or a deposit into your account.

Roll It Up

The second type of return process would be the bank that accepts rolled change only. These banks will generally accept fairly large amounts of rolled change from account holders, but it is best to call ahead and ask their policies on how much you can bring in and at what frequency. This is the only method that generally costs you money to return change as you must purchase empty coin rolls and take the time to re-roll them before getting cash back or depositing the funds into your bank account. If you are able to avoid using this method, this author believes that you should do so. As a side note! The instances of banks attempting to charge a fee for accepting customer wrapped coin rolls are increasing more and more. It is certainly unfortunate for those of us in the hobby but we must consider that our returned change is taking up room in the banks vault and the labor to load and possibly ship off boxes of coinage to a distribution facility. It is worth noting that a few branches near me do send off excess coinage weekly to other local branches to distribute throughout the community. This is even more of a reason to avoid this method, as you may inadvertently pick up rolls that you have already searched! No good!

Bag It Up

The third type of deposit is more common than one may think. That being the bagged coin deposit. Several coin hunting community members I have spoken to about this ensured me that dropping off a bag of loose coins at their bank and having it sent off to a different location to be counted and deposited into their bank account is the most simple method of all. It’s easier on the staff of the bank, easier on you for not having to dump into a machine, and certainly less expensive than re-rolling. Ensure that you check ahead with your bank that they accept bagged change for deposit. This method generally also takes the most amount of time to see the return of your initial capital, and in some instances may take 7-10 days to fully process the transaction.

Things To Remember

A general rule of thumb is to call ahead to a few local banks and inquire about their polices regarding accepting large quantities of change. I almost never show up to a bank that I am unfamiliar with to ask questions, as to not waste gas and time. If you happen to encounter a particularly rude or unhelpful employee on the phone, try calling back later in the day, or a different branch of the same bank. You are likely to find that you are required to open a savings or checking account with a particular bank to be able to have access to a dump method. You will generally find that in the long run the it is very much worth the effort and initial deposit required for opening an account. Ideally you will find a bank with multiple branches in your area, all of which offering at least one of the aforementioned options. Finally, it goes without saying but be polite and friendly. I personally don’t get too detailed with what I am doing unless I am directly asked “So what’s with all the change?”

Coinstar is EVIL

A few notes about Coinstar and similar machines. At the time of writing this, my local Coinstar Machine’s cash out fee is 11.9%. That is insane for the coin roll hunter who will be using the machines frequently. Just for fun I did the breakdown on what those fees add up to per box of coins.

  • $2.97 fee on a $25 box of Pennies.
  • $11.90 fee on a $100 box of Nickels.
  • $29.75 fee on a $250 box of Dimes.
  • $59.50 fee on a $500 box of Quarters or Half Dollars.Fifty nine dollars and fifty cents. That’s nearly 6 rolls of Quarters or Half Dollars.

That’s pretty outrageous right? Don’t use Coinstar.